When a wise man has a controversy with a foolish man,
The foolish man either rages or laughs, and there is no rest. – Proverbs 29:9
Incase you missed it, the full debate can be watched here and the full transcript can be read here. But if you don’t have time, then I think the above RNC web ad says it all. According to a CNN poll, Ryan won by a narrow margin of 48% as Biden received 44%. However, the CBS polls paint a different picture as Biden is said to have decisively won with 50% over the 31% Ryan received. But a CNBC poll says Paul Ryan won by 56% while Biden only received 36%. Looks like the victor is not as “obvious” to voters as it was with the Romney vs Obama debate.
In terms of debate performance, however, the moderate Chris Wallace deemed this to be the most disrespectful and openly contemptuous VP debate that he has ever seen. Biden interrupted Ryan 82 times, according to one count. Even liberals thought Joe Biden was a pompous jerk with his incessant smirking, laughing, and ridicule. A CNN focus group member called Biden a ‘buffoon’. To make matters worse, the moderator was clearly biased as she did nothing to stop Biden’s interruptions but was quite happy to interrupt and debate Paul Ryan.
My Thoughts: Paul Ryan come off as presidential, respectful, and informed. Joe Biden came off as a vile adolescent old man who’d scoff at the most inappropriate contexts (e.g, Romney’s charity, nuclear Iran, etc) and interrupt his opponent while demanding like a spoiled brat that he receive more time. I mean come on, what kind of debate was this? The moderator would sometimes argue with Ryan on certain issues, making this a 2 vs 1 debate. This was totally unfair and juvenile. But surprisingly, Ryan kept his calm and went right to the points that needed to be made. I personally think Ryan should’ve been more aggressive in areas, but he did do a good job given what he had to face. While a case can be made for why Biden might have won on the “arguments” alone, I think a good debate is also a fair debate. That’s not what this debate was at all. Biden had an unfair advantage, therefore, he should be treated as having shamefully lost this debate.
Despite how terrible this debate was, there were still a few gems to be found. I think the best analysis of every issue in the debate can be read here, which comes to the conclusion that Ryan only wins by a “narrow margin” when it comes to who successfully responded to the most points. I have been looking through the so-called “fact checkers” and I just find a lot of misinformation there as well. The Heritage Foundation demonstrates this very well with the issue of Medicare. Paul Ryan knows what he is talking about, it’s just difficult to argue that with someone who is bent on scoffing and twisting the facts. Let’s hope the next debate is better than this one.
3 Responses to WC News: The Vilest VP Debate
Justin October 12, 2012
In my opinion, Biden won quite handily, even if he was a little rude. Ryan’s debate performance was very carefully crafted with irrelevant anecdotes and “zingers”. Biden, on the other hand, is always going to be Biden. He has a big mouth, but at least he doesn’t pretend to be anything else.
All things considered, if the performances has been switched around, I doubt you would be calling Ryan “rude” and instead hilarious. Based purely on content, Biden won solely on the fact that he called Ryan out on several things(“bunch of malarkey”, 47%, etc). Ryan was calm, but he was backed into a corner several times and didn’t fight back.
So I guess, in my honest opinion, it was a clear victory for Biden. Just as Obama shouldn’t treat his next debate as a speech, Ryan shouldn’t treat his next debate as a soap opera audition. The debate was certainly entertaining!
Gil Sanders October 12, 2012
In my opinion, Biden won quite handily, even if he was a little rude.
I think that belittles just how rude it was. It was extremely rude and that is ultimately what gave the impression that he won this debate. A good debate is like I said a fair debate. This mantra that “Biden is always going to be Biden” is like saying a murderer is always going to be a murderer. It doesn’t justify Biden’s immoral actions and I am appalled that others think this kind of behavior is permissible.
Ryan’s debate performance was very carefully crafted with irrelevant anecdotes and “zingers”.
What anecdotes were “irrelevant”? Not sure what debate you saw, but I’m pretty Biden is the one who offered the “zingers” here. I think a perfect example of this was when Ryan said this has been done before and gave mentioned people who did, but then Biden retorted with “Oh, now you’re Jack Kennedy?”. That was just stupid and misses the ENTIRE point. Ryan made some legitimate points about the economy, he is after all an expert on this. And if you read the Heritage foundation article I linked to here, you’d see he was quite correct and the CBO backs him up.
All things considered, if the performances has been switched around, I doubt you would be calling Ryan “rude” and instead hilarious.
You doubt this because…? I sure as heck would not approve of Ryan if the performance was switched around. But I know you doubt this precisely because you seem to think that I have an agenda to paint republicans as nicely as possible. If you doubt what I say then at least see that even liberals agree with me.
Based purely on content, Biden won solely on the fact that he called Ryan out on several things(“bunch of malarkey”, 47%, etc). Ryan was calm, but he was backed into a corner several times and didn’t fight back.
This I can agree with because I was disappointed by how he did not retaliate. At the same time, it does show a great deal of character and patience to deal with someone as obnoxious as Biden. But calling something a bunch of malarkey or a bunch of stuff is hardly a refutation. There was one point about the letter that he should’ve continued to respond too, though. That was a bit disappointing… Both traded some blows, in my opinion, particularly toward the end. It’s just that Ryan had more of the facts and Biden’s false confidence made it seem like he was stating the facts.
Lerrrr October 13, 2012
Just watched the debate start to finish – and for one thing, I doubt if this will be a game changer for either side. Personally, didn’t see a clear cut victor.
With that in mind, I truly think anybodies conclusion on this (particularly as it was so close) is going to be coloured by their political leaning. Of course it is!
In my opinion, Biden looked stronger and I think his tactics were more effective than Ryan’s. Having said that, I think they also will have been more polarizing; he may find it backfires with undecided voters (that remains to be seen). Ryan was calmer, but at times looked weak against his opponent. I think his performance was “safer”, and as such I think it will have less influence on public opinion. Hence why I said in the beginning I don’t see a clear cut victor.